Paul (00:01.772)

Well, today is a special treat because we've been trying to get this together for a little while now. I'm proud, thrilled, always fun to have on the queen of LinkedIn and probably the queen of Midwest voiceover as it goes in the U S the wonderful and brilliant Tracy Lindley. Tracy, thank you so much for joining us today. It's.

Tracy Lindley (00:23.065)

It's my pleasure, Paul. That was an extreme intro, but you're very kind. I'm glad to be here with you too.

Paul (00:29.432)

Well, you know, the thing that always strikes me, there's two things that always strike me about you. One is how you've been able to build this ridiculously great career in what we affectionately call the, you know, the flyover States, right? You're out in the middle of the country. You're not in New York. You're not in LA. You're not in Chicago. And the second thing is you've got enough kids at home to field half a softball team. So I want to talk about that today too.

Honestly, those two things add up to I don't know how you do it all. I want to dig into that because I'm a time management freak as well. So let's start as they say at the very beginning. know, you and I, exactly right from the sound of music. You and I run into each other a lot of conferences. We get to chat for two minutes here, three minutes over there. We're on a panel together. Like it's a zoo.

Tracy Lindley (01:10.011)

very good place to start.

Paul (01:23.852)

And we really have never had a chance to sit down, you and I to actually have a chat. So I want to learn your story too. Where did it all start for you? Where did voiceover get on your radar? How did you get into it? Like, I don't know the Tracy Lindley story.

Tracy Lindley (01:39.067)

Well, it all started when I was 12 years old, Actually, that is, I mean, yeah, let's take a hike back to Tracy's childhood. Okay. So I was homeschooled. That is a fun fact that many people don't know. And I don't think I've ever shared that on anyone else's podcast. So you're the first to know I was homeschooled for many years, until my parents got divorced when I was 14 and I got tossed into a school, a high school of 1600 kids.

Paul (01:43.644)

Hold on, I gotta go get the way back machine. There we go.

Paul (01:57.889)

Wow.

Tracy Lindley (02:08.942)

So adaptability has been my life and resiliency and just dealing with whatever comes my way. I think that our childhoods actually, know, whatever happens there is going to help shape the rest of our lives. So I'm thankful for adversity. I'm thankful for challenges and I'm thankful for where I've come from. But when I was 12, I was still homeschooled and I went to the local library and I volunteered my time reading to young children. And I can't...

I had no idea that it would turn into something important, but reading out loud and literacy and being such a geek with English class language arts, like I always loved my high school English classes. I've always done creative writing. I've always kept a journal since I was a kid. Literacy and written language and spoken communication have been huge throughout my career. So I guess I would just start there. And those are the things that I instill in my kids as well.

is, guys, it's really important to learn not only to read, but to enjoy reading. Cold reading skills are so much of what we do. In fact, I just heard last week, I'm a little hoarse. I talked to you about this, Paul. I'm still getting over bronchitis. So I don't sound or feel totally myself yet. But your energy, I'm feeding off of. So thank you.

But anyway, I heard in the session at the end, was a new client. It was a new booking that I was really excited about. And at the end of it, they were British and they said, congratulations, you are the very first voice talent we have ever worked with that has read the script perfectly without adding or subtracting any words. And I took that as such a huge compliment. So literacy has been a huge part of my story, if you want to go way, way back, but to bring it up to speed,

how I got into actually doing voiceover was in college I had. I was pursuing a communication degree, which I did obtain. But at the time I thought for a hot minute that I wanted to do ad sales for TV. So I started working at the local cable company and trying to sell ads and I was, it was ridiculous. I'm not a salesperson. I don't enjoy it. It is not my love. But while I was there, the producer hands me a piece of paper and he's like, Hey, you have a nice voice. Will you read this?

Tracy Lindley (04:32.795)

So I go in their little tiny closet, you know, and I read this thing three times and I just, got it. I understood inflections. I understood timing. It was just natural. And I really think it stems back to reading to those kids in the library, you know, it's crazy. It's crazy how one step leads to another. And from that, the producer kept getting ahold of me throughout the years. So that was when I was, let's see, I would have been about 20. And so then,

Years go by and now I am toting. I'm a mom. have three children. I'm toting around the baby carrier with baby number three. And I go into this guy's studio. He's since changed jobs and he's still paying me 20 bucks to do a voiceover, but I had so much fun. Then I was like, sure, whatever. And in college, I was so broke. My veins are shot because I gave so much plasma. So.

That was good money for me. You're getting so far in the backstory today, Paul. But anyway, eventually I was like, hey, I'm sorry, I can't do this anymore for 20 bucks and I have to haul in three kids. It's not worth it. He said the magic words to me, which were, did you know you can do this from home? And it's called voiceover. That was it. So January 2014 is when I started, I hung out my shingle and I was like, I'm doing it. I don't care what it takes or how long it takes.

Paul (05:34.903)

I like it.

Paul (05:57.452)

Okay.

Tracy Lindley (05:59.513)

This is my path and I've never gone anywhere since. This is my dream career and what I was meant to do.

Paul (06:05.942)

So a belated happy 10 year anniversary in the business. That's amazing. The business has changed quite a bit in those 10 years, Trace. What was it like for you to get off the ground? Even the technology has changed in the last 10 years. What was it like for you to get off the ground in 2014? And where did you first start to find work?

Tracy Lindley (06:10.915)

Thank you.

Tracy Lindley (06:15.397)

for sure.

Tracy Lindley (06:30.233)

Well, I think a big part of my story is self research. When I get questions that people could have Googled that are coming to my inbox or my LinkedIn message, I'm disappointed because I really feel like everybody needs to do their own research. And I actually have put together a great resource page on my website, tracylindley.com slash resources, because I want to make it a little bit easier for people, but I also want them to do the legwork.

I mean, you put out so much great content just yourself, Paul. You have excellent videos. This podcast, like there's so many excellent things that just you as one person puts out into the world. So I have a list of other things that people can enjoy and they can read, research, watch. There's so many different ways to consume information. Video, audio, reading.

Paul (07:20.472)

Couldn't agree with you more. And it's not just you and I, there's the, you know, the JMCs and the Dervla trainers and they got you, the list is a mile long. And I think some people get frustrated with that and they don't realize that's an embarrassment of riches, right? Like you go back 10, 15 years, all that stuff didn't exist. Right?

Tracy Lindley (07:27.579)

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Tracy Lindley (07:38.587)

Mm-hmm. Well, 10 years ago, there were quite a few good opportunities to learn as well. But we've had so many pop-ups since then. But back in 2014, I would be, you I was in the throes of motherhood. I found out later that I had my fourth baby in July of 2015. So I was already two years into, or, you know, a year and a half in. It was crazy. It was the stupidest time ever to start a business. It didn't make any sense.

I figured, hey, if I can make, I don't know, a thousand bucks a month, that'll help my family with groceries, whatever. I wasn't out to make six figures, but within five years, that's what I accomplished. Because when you don't put so much pressure on yourself, sometimes that's when it happens. But you do have to take the right steps forward. And that's what I like about you too, Paul, is that you teach people direct marketing. That's been a huge part of my story is taking that one hour nap time or...

an hour and half, maybe two, it depends on how long whatever kid it was would sleep. That's when I would do my marketing and it was just totally non-negotiable. I would reach out to probably 20 people on LinkedIn during nap time. And that's what I was going to do. It was the only way I was going to grow my business. And I'm still taking kids to the library, the bounce house, the pumpkin patch. I'm still being a mom, but I was able to direct market in what I always called the cracks of life. And

I discovered LinkedIn accidentally. It became something that somebody messaged me and was like, hey, will you give me a quote for this script? And I didn't end up booking it. But then later he came back to me and, it turned the light bulb on, you know, and it was like, this isn't just Facebook where we're chatting about and sharing recipes or something. It's, this can be a business tool and a free one at that. And I've never paid for premium. I've always done free. So.

One piece led to another connecting the dots. I've accidentally found success and I'm trying to share what I can, but a lot of it has just been a lot of trial and error and oops, I guess that worked.

Paul (09:44.054)

Yeah, you say accidentally, but I think you know better because you use the phrase trial and error and that really is a it's a combination of the scientific method and persistence, right? Just hanging in there long enough to try more things that may or may not work and most of all not being afraid to what? Exactly, exactly. The one of the challenges I think you had in addition to raising half a softball team.

Tracy Lindley (10:04.389)

Fail.

Paul (10:13.834)

In the, how you need to start a course on how to get four kids to nap at the same time. I don't know how you do that. That's a superpower. but as you say, in the cracks of life, and also you're not, I mean, you're in Kansas city, and that's by no stretch, a major, major market. It's a midsize market at best. I always tell voice actors, unless you're in New York or LA, Chicago, or London, there's not enough work in your home market to support you.

Tracy Lindley (10:19.067)

Ha

Paul (10:43.542)

That's true in Richmond, where I am. It's true in Kansas City. So how do you, did that challenge even dawn on you? And if so, how did you thought, well, okay, how am gonna solve this? Because I'm not in the major metros here.

Tracy Lindley (10:59.045)

You know, I really think a lot of it has to do with my sister. She, have, I'm the middle kid of three. My older sister started at the time she was getting ready. She was doing things like virtual assistant, digital marketer. Now she's a coach for digital marketers, but, she's very successful. Both of us have, have encouraged each other along the way. And my brother's an entrepreneur too. My younger brother, builds databases. So.

All three of us are entrepreneurs. My dad was an entrepreneur. He passed away almost four years ago, but he, he, he was always an entrepreneur. He, I'm going to tell you another thing that a lot of people don't know. Paul, my dad sold firearms. grew up carrying rifles as a seven year old. yeah. gosh. If I had a nickel for every time he said that to me, I'm telling you all my secrets today.

Paul (11:45.196)

You'll do more than shoot your eye out with that thing. Right?

Tracy Lindley (11:53.779)

but anyway, and I know that there are people that, you know, guns bother them, but I grew up around them and learning how to treat them properly and with respect and as a hunting tool. But anyway, my dad was a gun dealer in the nineties. And so I watched him. I watched him as he had the freedom to live the kind of life he wanted to live. He did very, very well. And I got to travel with him on weekends, visited a lot of different cities in the area.

One of our favorites to go to was Oklahoma City. had such fun times. It was one-on-one spending time with dad. So I equated entrepreneurship with freedom and with doing what you enjoy. And he had such a passion for it. And I was never passionate about it, but I enjoyed spending time with him. But being around entrepreneurs, I think, makes a big difference and an impact.

Paul (12:48.44)

Did you, were you, like I don't know what the timing was like, were you old enough to see him start that business and maybe, I don't know his story, maybe struggle to get it off the ground early? No?

Tracy Lindley (13:01.475)

I don't think so. My dad was kind one of those people where he just knew what to do and it's like everything he touched turned to gold. He was just good at it.

Paul (13:12.434)

But definitely seeing him do it before you, like getting that entrepreneurial feel and spirit and mindset, most importantly, that had to be crucial.

Tracy Lindley (13:19.899)

Mm-hmm.

Yeah. And sometimes people look at owning a business as they're afraid of it because there's no safety net. If you fail, you don't have any money. But I never saw it that way because my dad was always successful with it and it allowed my mom to stay at home with us. And, you know, we could do traveling and we could take vacations and he had some things he, you know, he bought a couple planes and he became a pilot like private just for our family for a while.

He could pursue his hobbies and passions and do what he loved. So for me, I had a very positive experience of looking at entrepreneurship. So when I had the chance to do it, even though I'm a mom of four and that's my job, my husband's going to a regular eight to five, but also because he was going to the eight to five, we've got health insurance, we've got a steady income, so it's no pressure. So.

Because of my husband, I was able to confidently try something knowing that if I failed at it, we were gonna be fine. So I think that was part of it too. But to go back to your question about the market, I never saw Kansas City as my only option. I've never thought that small because I know that with the break, the internet has been out a while. So because we sell a digital product, we're very lucky.

that we don't have the overhead and those extra costs of paying for employees and insurance and just all these things, a storefront brick and mortar, we don't have any of that. We have a digital product that we get to do from home. We're extremely blessed to be able to be in this type of business. And so to me, it was low risk, high gain, the world's my oyster. When you go into it with that kind of attitude, how can you fail?

Paul (15:14.872)

How can you fail? Because mindset, as I often tell my students, if you don't have that screwed down tight, then your prospects are not good for success in this business. Let's go back to LinkedIn for a minute. You've been in this business, specifically voice acting, for 10 years. How has LinkedIn changed over the last 10 years?

Tracy Lindley (15:35.287)

I would say that LinkedIn has taken away a lot of the free features that I had become accustomed to. For example, as you well know, most of us, if not all, are limited to between five and 10 personalized invitations. I hate that. I hate it so much because part of what I did to grow my business was to send those personalized invitations to connect. Now,

Paul (15:43.106)

For example.

Tracy Lindley (16:01.813)

If you've got your profile optimized, I think people kind of get the gist of why you're reaching out and you don't look like a weirdo. But I don't like the way that LinkedIn took that away because I feel that it's more spammy. If I can personalize my invite, I can personally say, hey, I'd love to reach out to you. Here's why. I'm a voice actor. Whatever it is that people wanted to say in their personalized invite, that's a number one beef I have with LinkedIn. Now I'm also finding out that people are

getting even more limitations on simply searching for people. And even when they bookmark those searches, as I've taught folks to do, they're still finding limitations and they're being cut off where they can't even connect without the personalized invite because they're being cut off. So I feel like LinkedIn's gotten very greedy. I don't like the way that they have taken away the relational aspect that has really very much benefited me. And I feel

benefited the people that I would reach out to. I would rather have a personalized invite. I want to know why someone's connecting with me, but I also don't want a voice actor to waste that personalized invite just with connecting with me. So I'd rather that they save it instead of, but I do see a lot of personalized ones and I'm like, don't waste it on me. Save it for a client.

Paul (17:21.176)

Sure. Do you feel, having said that, that it's harder for voice actors and even creative entrepreneurs, graphic designers, coders, photographers, whoever it might be, to find work specifically on LinkedIn than it was, say, 10 years ago?

Tracy Lindley (17:36.091)

I think LinkedIn's made it more difficult, but there have been positive things too. Although they let us do that video intro that you could have on your profile picture and then they took it away. And I was like, why? I thought that was such a great way to get to know someone. I'm just disappointed. I mean, I've already complained to customer service. Every time they change something I don't like, I let them know, but it's done no good.

Paul (18:02.422)

Well, I'm surprised that they didn't take the suggestions from the Tracy Lindley Gap phone. So you built your business largely on the back of using LinkedIn and certainly have evolved with it over the years. If it's even a little bit harder now to find work on LinkedIn, is it harder overall to find work for voice actors?

And if so, else, what, in other words, in addition to LinkedIn, what else do you use to help keep your, your, your sales funnel full?

Tracy Lindley (18:41.627)

I have to say next to LinkedIn, the biggest way that I've grown my business is personal networking in person. As you and I know, going to Vio Atlanta, one voice conference, many of the other, there are several conferences, but Vio Atlanta is known to be the largest one. And you can make so many connections there. Anytime that I hear something about I don't want to connect with other voice talent,

because of the algorithm, they'll steal my clients, et cetera, et cetera. Give me whatever reason and I'm gonna toss it right out the window because people are how I have grown my business. I personally refer people to my clients because here's why. If I were to look at it completely selfishly, if I refer, let's just say you, let's say I have a client that says, hey, I need a mail and they describe the voice, whatever, anywhere from

30 to 45, whatever. I need a guy. I need a guy. I have you for this video and I need a guy for this other video. And I refer you and you go in and you slay it. Like you're just, you're so personable. You deliver on time. They loved working with you in the session. That makes me look good. So if I were completely selfish and that were the only reason I referred Paul Schmidt to my client, it's only to make me look good.

You know, okay, but let's move beyond that. That helps you. And guess what? You're gonna wanna refer me for the next one because I'm not obligating you to anything, but you're so grateful that you want to. And that is the beautiful cycle of giving. And so I love getting to know people personally. I can't get to know somebody just online. So even if I like somebody online, I have to meet them in person.

And I did have one circumstance where I referred someone to an agent and they were rude to that person. And I got a phone call from the agent telling me, so I never referred that person again. Unfortunately it happened, but that almost never happens. Out of the dozens of people I've referred, especially it seems like my Spanish bilingual friends always hear glowing things. It doesn't matter. I love to refer people. It brings me joy. It brings them joy, helps them get new clients.

Tracy Lindley (21:04.205)

It's amazing. I just referred somebody last week, somebody who needed a Chinese accented female. So I referred the fabulous Teresa Ho. If you don't know her, she's wonderful. Yes.

Paul (21:14.488)

She's in our community. Absolutely. I love Teresa. Talk about the other side of that coin for a minute, meaning the community of voice actors that we have. Referrals, certainly a positive. Always, always, always to be able to give and get business through our colleagues. But you're in Kansas City, and I would imagine, and can correct me if I'm wrong, Kansas City's a lot like Richmond. If I swing a dead cat in Richmond, I'm only going to hit about six or eight voice actors, right?

It's probably the same way in Kansas City. Talk about how you were able to build such a strong sense of community in the middle of the country.

Tracy Lindley (21:54.543)

Well, we do meetups. And so those will happen occasionally. My friend, Lori, puts those together a lot of times. And there's not a lot of us, but we're a strong community. I guess, I don't know. I don't really think about where people live, honestly. Because I'm so busy talking to people online or through Zoom, I don't really think about where they live. I don't feel like you're way over in Richmond. You just feel like you're right here talking to me. So I don't know.

I think it becomes irrelevant where someone lives. I do constantly think in my mind, what time zone is it for so and so? I'm always calculating time zones. But honestly, I just don't feel like it matters where you live. My agents don't care. My clients don't care, as long as I show up for the session. I have a new British client, and she's talking about 430 BST. And I'm thinking, OK, well, that's 1030 Central. No big deal.

It's a six hour times difference. And I do Google it though, because our daylight savings times are off. But that's the only thing that trips me up. So I will go ahead and check even the day of, and I'm always doubting myself. like, did something change with daylight savings? Like I hate daylight savings. Don't get me started about that.

Paul (23:09.868)

There is nothing that gives me more anxiety than time zone differences. Because I've made so many mistakes, right, along, you know, throughout the years that, yeah, I mean, I'm like you, I'm a double, triple checker, and even then I'm still nervous.

Tracy Lindley (23:15.257)

Uh-huh.

Tracy Lindley (23:26.181)

That's one of the most important things about our job is to show up on time. Reliability. was laying, I was just, I was chatting with my husband in bed the other day just talking about just where, where, where has this come from? We just chat about whatever. He's my best friend. We've been married for 20 years now. And then we were just talking about how beyond talent, beyond personality, reliability is pretty gosh darn important because if you can't show up for a session on time, you are screwed. And I have never once in 10 years missed a session.

After my dad passed away, I had a session because I knew what time it was going to be. I decided I was okay to do it. But then like later I canceled a webinar that I was supposed to teach because I was not okay to do that. So it's listening to yourself. It's what am I capable of? And when I have, you know, when I'm sick, what am I capable of? It's asking yourself, can I follow through on this session? I naturally have a raspy or voice and a little bit of texture. So

Not a single one of my clients knew I was even sick, but it was also chesty. It wasn't nasally. Sometimes you can get away with that a little bit more and you just like mute yourself to cough or whatever. But don't get me started laughing because I will start coughing. But I don't know. I think reliability is absolutely crucial. And I'm so thankful to know that someone else worries about time zones too.

because it makes you feel like the biggest idiot if you cannot calculate like one or two hours difference, right? But it's an easy mistake. So think about it, think about it, think about it, everybody.

Paul (25:00.588)

Well, not only think about it, but stay organized, right? Use the tools at your disposal, whether it's your email service provider, your calendar provider, whatever it might be, so that it offloads a lot of the work for you. And you've got a default. If you know your defaults work, then you're going to spend less time Googling and triple checking. And I've found that to be true for myself as well. Showing up on time is absolutely key and it costs absolutely

Tracy Lindley (25:03.62)

Yes.

Paul (25:30.15)

zero.

Tracy Lindley (25:31.289)

Right. And how about keeping your inbox organized too? Do you use Google, like the Google workspace? Do you use their star method and snoozes? Tell me how you use it. Let's talk about inboxes. Let's geek out for a minute.

Paul (25:37.824)

I do, I use Google Workspaces.

Paul (25:42.716)

Absolutely, I do. So anything so on my voiceover side, anything that comes in from any of my agents, any of the rosters that I'm on, I've automatically set up filters so that it gets starred, which means it goes to the top of my inbox. And it never gets deleted or sent to spam. Because I've had that happen to me. And that's why I had to figure those filters out and set them for myself. So

The great thing about that is if I've got auditions visually, it's very easy for me to just pop my inbox open because the start section is right at the top. And that's what helps keeps me organized there as well. And then I've learned to use the calendar editions to Google Workspaces. And it all works pretty seamlessly and helps keep me organized. I imagine you have a similar system, no?

Tracy Lindley (26:33.573)

Yes, in fact, I love the stars. Stars and the snooze feature are my two favorite features. I don't actually use any of the automatic folders and the spam and stuff. I just let everything go where it's supposed to go. But I also am very, very good about unsubscribing from things that I know I'm not reading. I train things to go to either promotions or social. And so only the good stuff is going to primary.

So if it's a yellow star, it's something I'm recording. My son is red. My next daughter is purple. The next daughter is green. And the next daughter is blue. So if they have jobs, then I put their star colors. And that way, the older ones have gotten so good at this that they go down. I'm like, OK, I have yours. Yours is the red star. You know, go down and record it. So my son just did that this morning. He had 20 words or whatever for a normal e-learning client.

So was like, go down and do that before school, please. And he did. And so it's uploaded and I don't have to deal with it after school because I don't like to deal with things after school if at all possible. And he has to work. He has a job at Chick-fil-A. So he's working from four to seven. He didn't have time. So I'm trying so hard to keep them organized too. But the snooze feature is huge for me. So I even have ongoing things like follow up on 60 to 90 day past due invoices.

Paul (27:39.202)

Sure.

Tracy Lindley (27:58.927)

that gets snoozed so that it's constantly cycling through so that once a month I'm checking those things. Because staying on top of your recordings is one thing and staying on top of your accounting is another. I don't know how much people outsource their stuff, but I'm very tight-fisted when it comes to how much control I will let go because I just don't trust anyone. No one cares about your business like you do. Fine if you want to have an assistant or do whatever, I will only let so much go and then it's on me and I want to do it.

Paul (28:27.518)

Agreed. think with four kids, I think your roster is larger than some that I've been on in my life. I want to take a minute and plug the webinar that we've got coming up, you and I. It's actually going to be you and I'm simply going to have the easy job of hosting and listening and learning. It's coming up on October 23rd at noon Eastern time. Tracy will be teaching what she knows best, which is

using LinkedIn to find business, optimizing your profile so that you've got the best chance of doing that. And that's coming up again October 23rd at noon. We'll put the link in the description. You can register at that link. And if you're a VO Pro member, if you're a member of my community, you'll find out in the community how you can attend that webinar for free. Tracy, it's always great to see you. I'm sorry that you're playing hurt today. I really appreciate it. I'm sorry you're sick and I hope you get better soon.

but as you say, you've got four Petri dishes at home. So, yeah, just keep taking your zinc. There you go. There you go. For me, it's zinc.

Tracy Lindley (29:26.521)

Yes, throat coat tea has been my savior. Or just they'll get sick of it and I just drink hot water.

Paul (29:36.408)

Yeah, nice, Tracy Lindley, the queen of LinkedIn, and we're really looking forward to seeing you again on the 23rd of October in the VO Pro community. And again, anybody can sign up for that. Thank you so much for being with us today and we will see you again in a couple of weeks.

Tracy Lindley (29:53.871)

Looking forward to it. Thanks, Paul.

Paul (29:56.938)

Okay. Wow.